Panel Discussion: Building a Business That Doesn’t Depend on You
This panel was recorded live at Build. Grow. Learn. In 2025, a business growth conference focused on systems, leadership, delegation, and sustainable scale.
The discussion centers on how business owners can step out of day-to-day operations, avoid becoming the bottleneck, and build companies that function independently.
Panelists:
- Susan Fennema – Process and operations expert, founder of Beyond the Chaos
- Joe Scarpetta – Entrepreneur and business owner focused on building sellable, self-sustaining companies
- Brandon Hayes – Moderator
The conversation explores delegation, documentation, AI tools, leadership psychology, burnout recovery, and what true operational freedom actually looks like.
Susan Fennema
One of the beauties—and why I like Teamwork—is that it has notebooks in it. When you document a process and write it in there, it’s basically a low-end Word document. When you update that document, you can choose who to send it to and it comes to them redlined, so you know what changed.
Which is so much better than, “Please see the new updated process,” that’s 15 pages long and I’m not going to tell you where the change is. Right?
So, some way to notify the change is important. The other is to follow up and confirm that the team member actually read the change. You can do that multiple ways. One could be building a task in your project tool and assigning it to each of them.
Another could be posting in Slack and saying, “I need an emoji when you read this process.” If you do that, you have to police it a little bit, but you can get a thumbs up or whatever you need for them to acknowledge they read it.
Once they’ve acknowledged it—if they don’t ask a question—they’re accountable to it. Even if they do ask a question, they’re accountable. But at least you know whether something needs further clarification.
Brandon Hayes (Moderator)
Joe, let’s say you delegate some important job function and it just doesn’t go well. What are the signs to you that it’s the wrong person versus you didn’t give them enough training?
My natural reaction when somebody doesn’t succeed is to jump in, micromanage, watch them do it, tell them exactly how to do it, and basically do it myself.
Joe Scarpetta
You sound like my brother.
I think some of it is actually doing what you’re saying—sitting down with them. If we’re talking about coding, sit with them, look over their shoulder, say, “Show me what you’re doing. Show me what you understood.”
Then determine: is it a training issue, a process issue, or a person issue?
The hardest part is avoiding the micromanagement. That thought of, “I can do this faster. I know I’ll do it right.”
But identifying which of those three it is helps rebuild trust. And sometimes it’s on us. I’d explain something and have five extra steps in my head that I never said out loud, assuming they’d just know.
So sometimes it was my fault. I had to own that. Now we’re much more deliberate in how we hand things off.
And never take it back. Never ever take it back. If they made a mistake, help them find the answer. Don’t give them the answer. Send them back to fix it. If they continually can’t do it, then you probably have a people problem.
Brandon Hayes
That “don’t take it back” is huge. That’s the most common tendency, right? Just put it back on my plate.
Let’s pivot—what about AI agents? Employees trained on uploaded SOPs, continuing to use that thread even after they leave. Everybody’s talking about it. Any success stories?
Susan Fennema
We use ChatGPT on the Teams version. That means I own the account. I can’t see into their chats, but I own it. If they leave, I can disconnect them.
It also lets me give ChatGPT our language, our typical responses, the way we word things. So it has the right background. I can’t see into their day-to-day, but I know it’s aligned.
And yes, you can turn off the setting that shares data back to improve the model.
Audience Member
Anybody using Claude?
Panel Response
Yes, some colleagues are. And we even run our written processes through ChatGPT before delivering them. It pokes holes in things we didn’t think of. It won’t be perfect, but it saves hours.
Audience Question
What are good starting points for creating documentation?
Susan Fennema
Video. Loom is amazing. Record yourself doing the process, talk through it, hand it off.
But writing is still important. Convert it into a written checklist or template. Videos are great for starting, but written processes are easier to update.
Sometimes we even have team members record their own processes—especially when they’re leaving. “Great, you gave two weeks’ notice? Record your job.”
Brandon Hayes
Let’s talk mistakes. What’s a mistake you made when trying to step back?
Susan Fennema
There are so many.
I’m not a micromanager… except I am.
I was a journalism major. I care deeply about how things are written. I used to write all our blogs. Eventually, I hired someone who knew my pet peeves. Then we moved to a marketing company—and they didn’t care as much.
So I proofread every single blog.
That does not save time.
Nobody else cares if a business is referred to as “they” instead of “it.” I had to let it go.
Joe Scarpetta
For me, it was guilt. Feeling like I wasn’t contributing if I wasn’t directly earning for the company. That was internal, not from my team.
Susan Fennema
And sometimes you “help” and end up in the way.
Or you become a “nice micromanager.” They know you’ll do it by the end of the day, so they wait you out.
There’s a great book—The One Minute Manager Meets the Monkey. It’s about people bringing you their monkeys and leaving them in your office. They need to take their monkeys back.
David (Audience)
Delegation requires not just responsibility—but authority.
Susan Fennema
Absolutely. You have to delegate authority. And you might have to back a decision you wouldn’t have made.
If you undermine their authority, trust breaks.
Brandon Hayes
What about when someone keeps coming back for approval?
Susan Fennema
Don’t answer the question. Ask, “What do you think we should do?”
Let them answer. If they’re right, just say, “Yep.” After a few times, they’ll stop asking.
And if it continues, tell them directly: “These are decisions you’re capable of making.”
Brandon Hayes
What does it feel like when you’ve achieved this freedom?
Joe Scarpetta
It’s wonderful and weird.
Beth went on vacation and told people to contact someone else—not me. Nobody reached out to me the entire time.
She said, “Well, it’s working.”
It means everyone did their job. No one needed me.
Susan Fennema
I went on a two-week Mediterranean cruise. Didn’t talk to anyone. It was wonderful.
You come back refreshed, creative, relaxed. And you realize maybe you can take Friday afternoons off.
It changes the trajectory of your business.
Joe Scarpetta
When I went away for three weeks, I delegated everything—even payroll. They changed my passwords so I couldn’t log in.
At 12 days, I finally relaxed. By week three, I was energized to return.
Three weeks is also a measure of sellability. The longer you can go without the business breaking, the more sellable it is.
If the business depends on you, you don’t own a business—you own a job.
Susan Fennema
Exactly. You can’t sell a business that depends on you.
And ask yourself: what’s your exit? Shut it down? Sell it? Hand it off? Your goal determines how far you go with this.
Final Takeaways
Joe Scarpetta:
Look way down the road. What does retirement look like? Don’t wait until 75 to live.
This freedom lets me be present for my family. That’s the biggest win.
Susan:
I had a client completely burned out. We took everything off her plate. She sat by the pool reading for three months.
We systemized her business and increased sales 65% while she rested.
If you’re burned out, ask for help. Otherwise, you’ll run your business into the ground.
Brandon Hayes (Closing)
This is obtainable. Achievable. Worth it.
Stop bottlenecking your own business.
Thank you all.